Monday, December 12

Coat fur discussion: what do you think about it?

Fur coats are not only a fashion issue and many topics were raised about them.
Focus on those issues you care the most.
Some trigger topics for discussion if you don't have anything in mind:
Would you wear this coat? It is warm since it is done of wolf's fur. The hunter wears it. Maybe it is appropriate when hunting in cold weather.
I'm puzzled:
"I rather go naked than wear fur."... but "I do nothing to stop the massacre of human beings".
What do you think about fur coats? What about the prices?
Would you wear faux fur? Wold you buy this one that costs $9,995.00 but is on sale for $4,995.00?
Do you think that if the animal is not in extinction it is ok to kill animals to make fur coats?
Leather has a different ethics than fur?
Shoes made of leather is acceptable since the synthetic leather has improved and can adapt to the feet just like real leather?
What about bags made of leather?
Please, feel free to ad your own issues about fur coats. There are lost of questions involved.
Thank you!


Mark p.s.2 said...

If you eat meat, then you can have little negative things to say about fur coats. How many cows, pigs and chickens are killed everyday?
In either, for food or for clothing, the animal has to be killed quickly so it doesn't feel so much pain as it dies.
I hope the same for myself when I die, as in to go quickly, rather than a slow and agonizing death.

Ana said...

Yes. I used not to have meat but now I'm eating.
Agonizing or a long wait for death? Please, no!
Quickly for me too.
I never thought too much about the fur coats and I just realized that I don't have to since I live in the tropics.
I always thought that it is kinda off ugly and bad taste.
I maybe wold wear it if I lived in Siberia not in a city but in a secluded town.
I think it's funny wearing the coat from your doorway till the car, from the car to the next doorway enter, show off the coat for 3 minutes and... take it out.
Maybe the question is:
"Fur what is it good for?"

Bellestina said...

The difference between leather and fur is that whilst the skin of a cow is taken from the animal after it has been slaughtered, fur is skinned alive from the animal. After having watched a video taken by hidden cameras at fur farms, I almost threw up, and I wept for the poor creatures. In nature, animals kill other animals. They take what is necessary, and the prey is given a chance to defend for itself whether through flight or fight. But in nature, animals do not kill other animals for petty reasons such as fashion. And when they kill, they kill as swiftly as they can. Yes there are rare cases where animals will toy with their prey before eating them, but ultimately, they kill out of necessity and they kill swiftly. That is why the fur industry is so barbaric and so utterly goes against nature. We take the skins of other animals for what? FASHION. And how do we do it? In the cruelest method possible - by beating the animals so all their bones break so they cannot put up much resistance, or my electrocuting them through their anus. Then we hang them upside down on hooks by one foot (whilst they are still alive!) and proceed to skin them alive, right in front of the other caged animals to see exactly what lies in store for them. When their fur is pulled off them, their carcasses are tossed onto piles, and often they are still alive. It can take up to hours for them to die afterwards. How can fashion justify something so cruel? These days the "but fur is the only thing that keeps you properly warm in winter" is just BS. There are plenty of synthetic jackets made that are better, lighter and cheaper, and don't carry such a high moral and environmental cost. These animals are still conscious when they are skinned alive for crying out loud, how can anything justify that? I think if all the people who coveted fur coats such as the one you posted a picture of here, saw the actual process of their fur coat being made, or better yet, were asked to skin the animals themselves to make their own fur coat, they wouldn't be able to stomach it. So why is it ok to pay others to engage in such barbaric cruelty, all so we can strut around the highs street feeling "chic" and in complete ignorance or denial of the true price of their fur. The price of fur isn't just the number on the price tags - it’s a lifetime of suffering for the animals who grow up on fur farms and are subjected to the most hideous treatment and cruelest death possible. Can you imagine if in another world, there existed species greater than human beings, who had the power to subject humans to their will just as we do to animals, and who found it fashionable to wear human skin, or human bones as necklaces, and that the quality of the bones were better if extracted from humans whilst they were still alive? Not only is the price of fur the suffering of animals, it is also environmental. In fact, fur farms are extremely hazardous to the environment. It takes 20 times as much fossil fuel to produce a fur coat than to produce the same sized synthetic jacket. Fur farms let off huge amounts of ammonia and formaldehyde into the atmosphere, poisoning nearby waterways and hindering the wintering of trees causing deforestation. I am a vegetarian and I don't believe in killing animals for any reason at all. But I do not condemn others for eating meat, because it is natural that humans, as natural predators, eat animals. I would not condemn a lion for eating a zebra. But I do condemn humans who buy and wear fur, because it is so horrific and nothing, absolutely nothing in this day and age where there are so many better alternatives to fur, can justify skinning an animal alive for the sake of fashion. Luckily there are many designers out there who have pledged to not use fur in their products. Brands such as Abercrombie & Fitch, Nine West, Diesel, Juicy Couture, Kate Spade, Calvin Klein and of course, the famous animal-friendly Stella McCartney are all fur-free brands. Why would anyone look food wearing something that caused such suffering?

Bellestina said...

Ps. Animal rights activists such as myself often get asked why we care about the suffering of animals but not the suffering of humans. Who says we don't care about the suffering of humans, why should we not be able to care about both human and animal rights? And even if a person was to solely occupy themselves with fighting to end the suffering of animals and not the suffering of humans, at least we are fighting for something good. I'd like to think of it as giving a voice for animals who cannot speak for themselves, unlike (most) humans who do. The ironic thing is that the people who accuse us of doing so much good for animals but none for humans are often those who don't do any good for either. Isn't it better to at least do some good, be actively and passionately engaged in some ethical cause, than to be involved in none at all? I believe every person in this world ought to find a cause that moves them, and actively engage themselves in it. Imagine if everyone chose something good to work towards, some change in the world they would like to bring about, be it environmental, human or animal (or all), how much better would the world not be?

Ana said...

Thank you very much for the explanation Ballestina. I didn't know that they killed for fur this way but I know that they kill cows in not such a painless way too.
I totally agree that every person should embrace a cause and I don't understand those who even stand on the way when people are fighting.
I was watching a documentary and wolves rarely kills "for fun" and I'm doing a research about it too.
Now I have no energy cause I was informed that my dog has cancer.
She is already 13 year-old but she is fine and don't look this age.
But she is changing little by little...
Thank you again and keep your fight.

Missy said...

I wouldn't wear it. It's a senseless reason to kill an animal when we have so many other clothing options.

Nicolette said...

Many years ago (27) I watched prize winning adverts in the cinema. A model dressed in a long fur coat was walking up and down the ramp. The coat was white. I don't remember what animal. You don't realise the point of the ad, until you see one drop of blood. And then another one, falling on the ramp and the people near it. Then drops of blood all over the ramp and the coat. And then a line of text appears: It takes 100 dumb animals to make this fur coat. And ONE to wear it.
And that is how I will always feel about it.
Leather = a byproduct of the meat industry. It would be wasted if it was not turned into shoes, handbags, isn't it? It is really a question, not anything loaded. So if that is the case, it's a different story altogether. The 'dumb' animals that are made into fur coats are killed just for that. It's a disgrace.

Anonymous said...

Fur is A-OKAY. No animals are skinned alive, that is pure PETA lies right there. I have personally seen and skinned fur animals myself, and it is impossible to do so while the animal is alive. Yes that video was real, but did you know PETA themselves paid two chinese men to do that? Don't believe me? Look it up. PETA's founder even admitted it because she failed to send the courts the UNEDITED version of the tape, the version where you can hear PETA advocates giving the men instructions on how to do it. In the video there are also chinese speaking witnessess saying "Why are you skinning it alive!? You're gonna get fired, it's against regulations!"

Also, many animal righters unintentionally support fur farms that they are so against. Wear make up? Tan? Foundation? Rubber bottomed shoes? Rubber tires? Mink oil (fat) is used all for that. So as they spew their "logic" they are being hypocrits themselves.

Fur farms in Canada, U.S, and Europe are all heavilly regulated and hold animal wellfare in highest regard. If one farm is showing just ONE flaw, it is tagged to be shut down unless improvments are made.

Infact, fur farms have the best treated livestock on earth. These mink must be kept happy at all times, especially during pregnancy, as females have Delayed Implantation. Stressed mink = year late litter= money in the hole. Another proof of careful care is the simple equation here. Poor care = poor fur = poor profits. If you mistreat the animals, they will be stressed, lick their fur into patches (look up Sterotype Behaviour for mistreated zoo animals and you'll get what I mean here). It's a fact that healthy animals have healthy coats. If the mink were tortured, they wouldn't have such nice hides.

Here's where other industries play a huge part in mink care. Eggs, meat, fish, and yes, even veggies vegans buy, help support feeding these mink. So regardless, unless you grow your own food, you support mink farming (and you better make your own fertilizer too, mink feces are the best manure out there.). Also, if you want to be mink farm free, you better quit buying pet food. Yes, mink bodies are turned into that by-product and often mixed with poultry bi product. Nothing is wasted in a good, well maintained fur ranch.

"Well I'll be kind and buy faux"...

That is possibly the CRUELEST thing you can do to Mother Earth! Don't ever buy faux! Despite the hype that it's friendly, it is NOT. It takes 600 years for it to actually degrade in a landfill! It releases fumes into the air and water during the production of faux materials. 99% of faux fur is made in China, where there is no regulation for keeping the air clean! Excess oils and fumes are leaking into the air and waters, killing tons of animals, especially key creatures to the eco system, such as amphibians and fish. Poor worker wellfare results in underpaid men, woman and possibly children who get exposed to these cancer causing fumes.

So yes, fur is actually the best choice, and is eco friendly (seriously, our fur wearing ancestors didn't have the pollution we do today). It's perfectly okay, as fur farmers use bottled monoxide to dispatch their animals, or euthanasia with sedation (without sedation, it is painful and this is how poor shelters do it). Fur farms take better care of animals than most animal-related industries.

Sorry for TLDR message, but take it from someone who actually knows personally how fur works and how eco friendly it is.

I have a real coat and I have owned a faux, both around same time. The faux did what is called "Wooling" in just under a year and it had to be gone. The real fur is going strong and has no signs a wear or wooling, as it never will. Wooling is native to fauxs only. Wooling is where the longer hairs tangle up and form a frizzy ruff with tuffs sticking out here and there, looking like scrapes and mange.

Ana said...

I will have to search the age the minks are killed after receiving all these paradisiac comforts.
I like the work of SHAC better than PETA.
Anyway... I only see the reason to have a fur coat if one leaves in a highly cold place without devices to warm the ambient.
Using fur to go from a doorway to another... it makes no sense for me.
And as I have already said:

I never thought too much about the fur coats and I just realized that I don't have to since I live in the tropics.
I always thought that it is kinda off ugly and bad taste.
I maybe wold wear it if I lived in Siberia not in a city but in a secluded town.
I think it's funny wearing the coat from your doorway till the car, from the car to the next doorway enter, show off the coat for 3 minutes and... take it out.
Maybe the question is:
"Fur what is it good for?"

Ana said...

This is highly controversial. And people don't believe in black and white issues....

Anonymous said...

Err... yeah, this is controversal and i think wearing fur do executes both good and bad aspects in human lives and i strictly think it's a personal choice to choose fur . I agree that we should respect animal rights and not killing them for their fur, but what is the optimum choice to solve this controversial ? Main issues are related to fur ... FUR FUR AND FUR.... in my opinion , people got pissed off for fur-lovers generally because of their personal love for furry animals, and only furry animals and no big statements given against eating meat and have animal's skin made into something else , some claimed "skins are taken after the animals are slaughtered for their meat, but fur is skinned when the animals are still alive " (not from this forum) yes, it's cruel that animals got skinned lively but... both slaughtering and skinning does starts with pain ...

Ana said...

Alive or dead I don't like and see no reason to use fur coats.
There are synthetic furs that looks very real... "OMG! I will never were fake fur."
SO it becomes another issue: status and display of power.
"i wear fur to show I'm powerful and have enough money to have it."
For me it makes another statement But this is me.
Again: I think that fur is bad taste and don't find anything glamorous is it.
It's is a dead animal.
So for me the issue has to do with right, ethics and taste.
Fur is kitsch for me.
What about those things with the head of the animal women used over their neck.
Gimme a break!
I'm not vegan but I was once.